Red Dragon and Black Dragon and Giant and Titan: Difference between pages

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{{Dungeon creatures}}{{Creature
{{Tower creatures}}{{Creature
  | AI_Value  = 4702
  | AI_Value  = 3718
  | Name      = Red Dragon
  | Name      = Giant
  | Attack    = 19
  | Attack    = 19
  | Defense  = 19
  | Defense  = 16
  | Speed    = 11
  | Speed    = 7
  | Growth    = 1
  | Growth    = 1
  | Damage    = 40–50
  | Damage    = 40–60
  | Health    = 180
  | Health    = 150
| Movement  = [[Flying]]
  | Res      = [[File: Resource Gem 20x18.gif]]
| Size      = 2
  | Res      = [[File: Resource Sulfur 20x18.gif]]
  | ResCost  = 1
  | ResCost  = 1
  | Cost      = 2500
  | Cost      = 2000
  | Special  = • [[Dragon]]<br>• [[Breath attack]]<br>• [[Spell immunity|Immune to spells]] level 1–3
  | Special  = • [[Immunity]] to [[mind spell]]s
  | U_AI_Value= 8721
  | U_AI_Value= 7500
  | U_name    = Black Dragon
  | U_name    = Titan
  | U_attack  = '''25'''
  | U_attack  = '''24'''
  | U_defense = '''25'''
  | U_defense = '''24'''
  | U_speed  = '''15'''
  | U_speed  = '''11'''
| U_damage  = 40–60
  | U_health  = '''300'''
  | U_health  = '''300'''
  | U_cost    = 4000
  | U_shots  = '''24'''
  | U_ResCost = 2
  | U_ResCost = 2
  | U_special = • [[Dragon]]<br>• [[Breath attack]]<br>• [[Spell immunity|Immune]] to all spells<br>• [[Hate]]s [[Giant and titan|Titans]]
| U_cost    = 5000
  | U_special = • [[Ranged attack]]<br>• [[Immunity]] to [[mind spell]]s<br>• No [[melee Penalty]]<br>• [[Hate]]s [[Black Dragon]]s
  | No_shots  =  
  | No_shots  =  
| No_ushots =
}}
}}


{{Cram|Dragon Cave|Red Dragon|Black Dragon|no_dwelling=}}
{{Cram|Cloud Temple|Giant|Titan|no_dwelling=|pad=3px 10px 3px 5px}}
'''Red Dragons and Black Dragons''' are level 7 creatures of [[Dungeon]], and are recruited from the [[Dragon Cave]].
'''Giants and Titans''' are level 7 creatures of [[Tower town]]. They are recruited from the [[Cloud Temple]].


''"Red and black dragons with their great mobility, flying ability, and powerful [[breath attack|breath weapons]] are among the most effective units in the game. Red dragons are [[Spell immunity|immune to spells]] below level four. Black dragons are twice as durable, do [[Hate|150% damage]] to... [[Giant and titan|titans]], and are immune to all spells."{{-}}<sup>[[Restoration of Erathia Manual Page 91|RoE manual]]''</sup>
''"Giants and titans are immune to [[mind spells|spells affecting the mind]]. Titans do 150% damage to [[black dragon]]s, can hurl lightning bolts in a ranged attack and suffer no [[melee penalty|penalty for hand-to-hand attacks]], making them the most powerful ranged attack unit in the game."{{-}}<sup>[[Restoration of Erathia Manual Page 115|RoE manual]]''</sup>


== Tactics and info ==
== Tactics, info and abilities ==
=== Toughness ===
=== Toughness ===
With the health value of 300, Black Dragon is one of the toughest creatures in the game. In the original {{roe}}, it was toughest of the [[dragon]]s and its health was only matched by [[Titan]]s' and [[Ancient Behemoth]]s' (and by Haspid's in {{hota}}). It also has more Defense than either of those creatures. {{ab}} expansion introduced four new dragons, [[Faerie Dragon]], [[Rust Dragon]]s, [[Crystal Dragon]]s and [[Azure Dragon]]s, which all are neutral creatures and have more health than Black Dragons.
With a health value of 150 and 16 defense, Giants have the lowest health for a level 7 creature, also boasting the second lowest defense value of a level 7 unit, the [[Bone Dragon|Bone Dragon's]] being lower by 1. On the other hand, Titans have the highest health for a level 7 unit that is not neutral, it's value being 300, only matched by the [[Black Dragon|Black Dragon's]] and the [[Ancient Behemoth|Ancient Behemoth's]] in {{roe}} (and [[Haspid|Haspid's]] in {{hota}}). However, Titans have 1 less defense than the [[Black Dragon]], but 5 more than the [[Ancient Behemoth]] (also 4 more than [[Haspid]] from {{hota}}). Their upgrade's health and defense bonus is also the highest in the game, being a bonus of +8 defense from the base creature and double the health.
 
=== Offense ===
Giants and Titans have the highest max and overall (together with the [[Angel and Archangel|Angels and Archangels]]) damage of a town affiliated creature, even higher than a [[Black Dragon|Black Dragon's]] or [[Gold Dragon|Gold Dragon's]]. However, they have 1 less attack than the [[Black Dragon]] and 6 less than the most powerful town creature, the [[Archangel]]. Still, the difference between the [[Black Dragon|Black Dragon's]] and the Titan's attack stat is minimal, and the later will mostly not even be retaliated against when attacking, since they primarily use a ranged attack. And even then, the Titans have no-melee penalty.
 
=== Efficiency and cost ===
Giants are very unimpressive 7th level creatures, and may not be worth the gold until your Cloud Temple sees an upgrade, especially due to their low health, defense and likelihood of being targeted by the AI. Titans, on the other hand, stand strong as one of the most powerful creatures in the game, boasting the highest health and max damage for an unit that is not neutral. However, here comes their only weakness: their creature and dwelling upgrade cost. The Titans are 1000 gold {{g}} more expensive than a [[Black Dragon]] with a similar efficiency and 1 gem {{gem}} less than an [[Archangel]]. The dwelling upgrade is also expensive in itself, but unlike other level 7 dwellings, you only pay a little price for the base dwelling (allowing you to accumulate more troops earlier), and pay the rest of the resources with the upgrade.


=== Tactics ===
=== Tactics ===
Because of the Black Dragons' spell immunity, they are suitable to be used in tactics often called [[dragogeddon]]. In dragogeddon, a hero with preferably high [[power skill]] and [[Armageddon]] spell attacks with an army only consisting of creatures immune or very resilient to the Armageddon spell. The tactics may be used in "hit-and-run" tactic, to advance through wandering creatures or even to slay enemy heroes. In {{roe}} series, Black Dragons were the best creature to use in dragogeddon.  
If your hero happens to be an expert in [[Earth Magic]] with [[slow]] you will be able to dismantle a majority of neutral creatures (not necessarily with the help of [[mages]]) before they can land a blow. Additionally - with their [[Mind Spells|mind spell immunity]], Titans will not fall prey to the [[forgetfulness]] and [[berserk]] spell. Even in melee combat, your Titans should lead you to victory in a wide range of combat match-ups.


The benefit of using Black Dragons in this tactics is their high initiative, in other words, their speed. Only [[Phoenix]]es and [[Gold Dragon]]s are faster creatures that are immune to Armageddon. High initative enables hero to act first in the combat, and this way possibly win the battle before enemy gets a chance to flee, surrender or otherwise cause resistance.
===Skill bonuses ===
A hero with [[Archery]] as a skill would be very efficient, increasing the Titans' damage output more than [[Offense]] would to other level 7 creatures ([[Archery]] also has damage bonus artifacts, unlike [[Offense]]), making them deal 150% damage in ranged attacks with Expert Archery.


=== Semantics ===  
=== Semantics ===  
Together with the [[Titan]], the Black Dragon has become a symbol of the Heroes series since it first appeared in Heroes of Might and Magic II: The Succession Wars.
Together with the [[Black Dragon]], the Titan has become a symbol of the Heroes series since it first appeared in Heroes of Might and Magic II: The Succession Wars.
 
== Special Abilities ==


=====Magic Immunity=====
=== Others ===
This spell immunity is a double-edged sword, though, as it makes both Red and Black dragons immune to most beneficial spells, including [[Resurrection]]. Placing Red or Black Dragons (as well as any living Dragons) in the [[Skeleton Transformer]] will give you [[Bone Dragon]]s instead of regular [[Skeleton]]s.
Titans are one of the two upgraded tier 7 units that occupy one hex, the other being [[Arch Devil]]. They are also living constructs, being able to be resurrected, unlike [[Stone Golem and Iron Golem|golems]] and [[Stone Gargoyle and Obsidian Gargoyle|gargoyles]], but similar to the [[Crystal Dragon]].


Both dragons are affected by [[Dispel]].
== Trivia ==


=====Hates Titans=====
The ability to "burn with anger" and do extra damage to black dragons is likely a reference to 3DO's previous title Heroes of Might and Magic II. In that game, the Wizard and Warlock were widely considered to be the strongest heroes and there was some debate among players as to the single strongest 6th level creature. It's also probably because they are supposed to be the opposite of "chaos", the [[black dragon]], being created by the wizards with the scope of slaying them.
Though it is stated in the manual, Black Dragons do not hate [[Giant]]s.


{{creature 'see also'}}
{{creature 'see also'}}


[[Category: Creatures]]
[[Category: Creatures]]

Revision as of 17:32, 21 March 2020

Tower creatures
Level 1
Gremlin Gremlin
Master Gremlin Master Gremlin
Level 2
Stone Gargoyle Stone Gargoyle
Obsidian Gargoyle Obsidian Gargoyle
Level 3
Stone Golem Stone Golem
Iron Golem Iron Golem
Level 4
Mage Mage
Arch Mage Arch Mage
Level 5
Genie Genie
Master Genie Master Genie
Level 6
Naga Naga
Naga Queen Naga Queen
Level 7
Giant Giant
Titan Titan
Towns
Castle Stronghold Inferno
Rampart Fortress Necropolis
Tower Conflux Dungeon
Factory Cove
Neutral
Statistics
Giant
 Cost per troop 

2000

1
Attack 19
Defense 16
Damage 40–60
Health 150
Speed 7
Movement Ground
Size 1
Growth 1
AI Value 3718
 Special abilities:
Immunity to mind spells
Titan
 Cost per troop 

5000

2
Attack 24
Defense 24
Damage 40–60
Health 300
Speed 11
Movement Ground
Size 1
Shots 24
Growth 1
AI Value 7500
 Special abilities:
Ranged attack
Immunity to mind spells
• No melee Penalty
Hates Black Dragons
Cloud Temple  

Giants and Titans are level 7 creatures of Tower town. They are recruited from the Cloud Temple.

"Giants and titans are immune to spells affecting the mind. Titans do 150% damage to black dragons, can hurl lightning bolts in a ranged attack and suffer no penalty for hand-to-hand attacks, making them the most powerful ranged attack unit in the game." RoE manual

Tactics, info and abilities

Toughness

With a health value of 150 and 16 defense, Giants have the lowest health for a level 7 creature, also boasting the second lowest defense value of a level 7 unit, the Bone Dragon's being lower by 1. On the other hand, Titans have the highest health for a level 7 unit that is not neutral, it's value being 300, only matched by the Black Dragon's and the Ancient Behemoth's in Restoration of Erathia (and Haspid's in Horn of the Abyss). However, Titans have 1 less defense than the Black Dragon, but 5 more than the Ancient Behemoth (also 4 more than Haspid from Horn of the Abyss). Their upgrade's health and defense bonus is also the highest in the game, being a bonus of +8 defense from the base creature and double the health.

Offense

Giants and Titans have the highest max and overall (together with the Angels and Archangels) damage of a town affiliated creature, even higher than a Black Dragon's or Gold Dragon's. However, they have 1 less attack than the Black Dragon and 6 less than the most powerful town creature, the Archangel. Still, the difference between the Black Dragon's and the Titan's attack stat is minimal, and the later will mostly not even be retaliated against when attacking, since they primarily use a ranged attack. And even then, the Titans have no-melee penalty.

Efficiency and cost

Giants are very unimpressive 7th level creatures, and may not be worth the gold until your Cloud Temple sees an upgrade, especially due to their low health, defense and likelihood of being targeted by the AI. Titans, on the other hand, stand strong as one of the most powerful creatures in the game, boasting the highest health and max damage for an unit that is not neutral. However, here comes their only weakness: their creature and dwelling upgrade cost. The Titans are 1000 gold Gold more expensive than a Black Dragon with a similar efficiency and 1 gem Gem less than an Archangel. The dwelling upgrade is also expensive in itself, but unlike other level 7 dwellings, you only pay a little price for the base dwelling (allowing you to accumulate more troops earlier), and pay the rest of the resources with the upgrade.

Tactics

If your hero happens to be an expert in Earth Magic with slow you will be able to dismantle a majority of neutral creatures (not necessarily with the help of mages) before they can land a blow. Additionally - with their mind spell immunity, Titans will not fall prey to the forgetfulness and berserk spell. Even in melee combat, your Titans should lead you to victory in a wide range of combat match-ups.

Skill bonuses

A hero with Archery as a skill would be very efficient, increasing the Titans' damage output more than Offense would to other level 7 creatures (Archery also has damage bonus artifacts, unlike Offense), making them deal 150% damage in ranged attacks with Expert Archery.

Semantics

Together with the Black Dragon, the Titan has become a symbol of the Heroes series since it first appeared in Heroes of Might and Magic II: The Succession Wars.

Others

Titans are one of the two upgraded tier 7 units that occupy one hex, the other being Arch Devil. They are also living constructs, being able to be resurrected, unlike golems and gargoyles, but similar to the Crystal Dragon.

Trivia

The ability to "burn with anger" and do extra damage to black dragons is likely a reference to 3DO's previous title Heroes of Might and Magic II. In that game, the Wizard and Warlock were widely considered to be the strongest heroes and there was some debate among players as to the single strongest 6th level creature. It's also probably because they are supposed to be the opposite of "chaos", the black dragon, being created by the wizards with the scope of slaying them.

See also: