User talk:Fafner: Difference between revisions

From Heroes 3 wiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search
 
(5 intermediate revisions by 2 users not shown)
Line 11: Line 11:


I just wonder. Myself I'm not a pure fan of Necropolis, I also love playing Rampart, Stronghold and Fortress (thanks to campaigns). I completely don't understand Dungeon and don't enjoy playing for it, although I admire its strength (if you love Tower, it should make you happy :)) ).--[[User:Dread Knight|Dread Knight]] ([[User talk:Dread Knight|talk]]) 10:37, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
I just wonder. Myself I'm not a pure fan of Necropolis, I also love playing Rampart, Stronghold and Fortress (thanks to campaigns). I completely don't understand Dungeon and don't enjoy playing for it, although I admire its strength (if you love Tower, it should make you happy :)) ).--[[User:Dread Knight|Dread Knight]] ([[User talk:Dread Knight|talk]]) 10:37, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
:Great job Watson, took you few months to connect the dots, and you still got it wrong - I am not a "fan of Tower" as in "rabid stadium hooligan on a crusade for his beloved faction". Tower is my preferred choice because I've played it for 22 years and I know how to make this normally average (B tier, has good parts & bad parts in relative balance, nothing really broken) town sing. Your own preferences make no difference to me, as long as you don't go around preaching how town X is the one true way and all others suck or something like that - [[User:Fafner|Fafner]] ([[User talk:Fafner|talk]]) 14:38, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
::Wow. That's nice. BTW many people consider Tower broken:) I don't think so, while there are many superadvantages like master gremlins, who can be easily collected in vast amounts, free spells when having Magi, very strong Naga Queens, Wall of Knowledge, etc. However, in my opinion, what is really overpowered (aside from Necropolis and Conflux with their great features), it is Dungeon. There are no useless troops aside from Troglodytes, perfect 2-level unit, two shooters without melee penalty, powerful Minotaurs, and also there is a possibility to get Armageddon - your Titans shouldn't hear who will rock the map in this case. If there are dwellings of those ones, you may collect dozens and dozens of them via Portal. Mana Vortex is a pure imba, as you'll never run out of spell points; on small maps, Academy will be a factory of producing heroes one level above all others - 2 level vs. 1 is better difference than 26 vs. 25. A great disadvantage is that Dungeon is very expensive and even to get intermediate units you should use all types of resources. Generally - the best recipe to win is to play properly, not to choose a correct town. I wonder if you watch sports, but there will be always someone like Russia and Canada in hockey, Manchester City in nowadays English Premier League, or Mercedes in nowadays Formula One. Same for gaming, and to win Heroes 3 with Rampart or Fortress is still way easier than to win EPL with Sheffield United :)))
::PS. As for Implosion on Gold Dragons. Of course I understand that, prior to all, you should control the battle. Mass Slow is a thing, as Elves, Pegasi, and Unicorns have decent speed. As for Berserk, it's possibly works on its best against Rampart - cast it on Dendroids, and that's all :)) However, Gold Dragons are powerful, thus taking them out in large amounts will still help.
::In my opinion, Rampart is generally the worst town. Those who are tanky are horribly slow, and those who are fast are horribly fragile. Unicorns are fully in the middle, just a symbol of a "balanced" unit - 5th place, stronger than Manticores, Cyclops, Wyverns, and Psychic Elementals, and weaker than Champions, Nagas, Efreeti, and Dread Knights. Gold Dragons are unfairly expensive, matching best units by price but not by quality. Inferno has a great ability of demon farming, and Fortress is brilliant in defense, also providing the fastest unit in the game aside from 7 levels. Rampart attracts many people due to its units reminding Lord of the Rings, and also there are numerous campaigns about Rampart, yet I think that almost every town may outscore it: Castle and Stronghold by brute force, Tower, Dungeon and Conflux by magic, Inferno by its features like Town Gate and demon farming, and we are not mentioning Necropolis. Fortress has reliable Basilisks, imbalance Mighty Gorgons, Wyverns who are cool when sieging towns, and thanks to Dragonflies, it will cast first spell before 7 level units appear.--[[User:Dread Knight|Dread Knight]] ([[User talk:Dread Knight|talk]]) 11:10, 23 April 2021 (UTC)
:::Tower is not broken - its advantages come at a price of sky-high resource cost, you could build up 2 "cheap" towns for what you need to deck one Tower out. Its units generally need upgrades to be useful, or just to not suck (Gremlins, Nagas, Giants). Naga Queens & Titans are very strong, but also very expensive, and thanks to them the cost of week's full growth is over 28k which means you need external gold source or decisions every week what not to recruit... and this assumes you have managed to get to that point, good luck doing this against competent enemy. Lots of building requirements, so more time & resources needed. Heroes are meh apart from few top contenders like Solmyr, Neela, maybe Torosar. It's THE worst town to play in low resources environment.
:::Dungeon is A tier btw, because it's generally good at everything, its good stuff is expensive but not quite at Tower level, and the useless unit is Manticore/Scorpicore - apart from speed and health it could be 5th level unit, Minotaurs hit almost as hard and are cheaper & more numerous.
:::Rampart is kinda B - okay mix of offense/defense but only 1 very fragile shooter, units in general screw with magic, but 2 units are critically slow, best unit cannot be buffed & resurrected without Orb of Vulnerability, Gold Dragons have very high att/def but require tons of crystal, Treasury allows for gold shenanigans but this requires time, and heroes are average.
:::Fortress is A-C depending on situation. Cheap, tough troops are good in early game, but level 3 mage guild combined with overall slow troops is just plain bad in endgame. 2 flyers, both very fragile. Only 1 shooter, tough but not very strong. Mighty Gorgons are tough & scary but also slow & not that strong apart from their special ability. Hydras shine if you can get them in good position, otherwise they are slow and weak damage sponges as their stats apart from HP are very low. Crazy good heroes (Tazar) and bad (most of others).
:::Inferno is just plain bad, just compare it to Castle and notice the glaring power gap while the costs are similar. The only thing it does well is melee, the troops are overall good in offense but squishy, can execute Efreetgeddon or annoy slow/ranged armies with Devils. Magogs are the only ranged unit that can hurt your own troops. Devils are noticeably weaker than Angels but are similarly expensive. Efreeti are fast but fragile and don't do much damage on their own. Demon farming lets you convert bad troops to a bit more useful form, but it takes some time and isn't even close to Necromancy in efficiency. Town Gate is only useful if there are other Inferno towns. Heroes apart from Marius are meh to bad. The cost nerfs were made because all these things were noticed, and still it was not enough, without some power boost Inferno is about the only D/E tier town. - [[User:Fafner|Fafner]] ([[User talk:Fafner|talk]]) 13:04, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
::::Do you mean it all for big maps? If yes, I can just trust you. I play chiefly campaigns which don't have XL maps (poor Mutare, she is waiting for months). For smaller maps, Inferno has cool features, and Efreeti are in top 4 among 6th levels. Myself I feel there should be one single feature which can make Inferno really stronger: if Arch Devils were faster than Archangels. Inferno 7 level is weaker than Castle's one, but still a bit cheaper, and if it had that opportunity to be like, sorry, Sprite of its level, it would become an imba (Inferno already has Cerberi which are great 3 level units as opposed to many ones - Golems, Wights, Orcs, and I don't like Griffins). As for Tower, I wrote it's one of the worst towns for Impossible level (however, master gremlins help a lot).--[[User:Dread Knight|Dread Knight]] ([[User talk:Dread Knight|talk]]) 23:24, 26 April 2021 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 23:24, 26 April 2021

Map Editor[edit | hide | hide all]

Where did you get maps from campaigns? That was really cool.--Dread Knight (talk) 22:55, 11 March 2021 (UTC)

Extracted with MMArchive from H3 folder/Data/ .lod archives, most possibly. Then opened with the campaign editor after which extracted the maps from the campaign.--FirePaladin2 (talk) 23:24, 11 March 2021 (UTC)
Thanks FirePaladin2! So it's only possible when installing WOG?--Dread Knight (talk) 07:18, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
WoG is not required. This tool is standalone--Mortarial (talk) 10:35, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
^ Btw, no need to add the "2" at the end of my name, it just happens that I forgot my password to my main account (although I probably should have used a random number instead of "2" for this one kek).--FirePaladin2 (talk) 11:10, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
ResEdit. The screenshot was from WoG editor as I have both SoD and WoG installed independently and couldn't bother to open the map in SoD editor. -Fafner (talk) 15:04, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

Are you a Tower fan?[edit | hide]

I just wonder. Myself I'm not a pure fan of Necropolis, I also love playing Rampart, Stronghold and Fortress (thanks to campaigns). I completely don't understand Dungeon and don't enjoy playing for it, although I admire its strength (if you love Tower, it should make you happy :)) ).--Dread Knight (talk) 10:37, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

Great job Watson, took you few months to connect the dots, and you still got it wrong - I am not a "fan of Tower" as in "rabid stadium hooligan on a crusade for his beloved faction". Tower is my preferred choice because I've played it for 22 years and I know how to make this normally average (B tier, has good parts & bad parts in relative balance, nothing really broken) town sing. Your own preferences make no difference to me, as long as you don't go around preaching how town X is the one true way and all others suck or something like that - Fafner (talk) 14:38, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
Wow. That's nice. BTW many people consider Tower broken:) I don't think so, while there are many superadvantages like master gremlins, who can be easily collected in vast amounts, free spells when having Magi, very strong Naga Queens, Wall of Knowledge, etc. However, in my opinion, what is really overpowered (aside from Necropolis and Conflux with their great features), it is Dungeon. There are no useless troops aside from Troglodytes, perfect 2-level unit, two shooters without melee penalty, powerful Minotaurs, and also there is a possibility to get Armageddon - your Titans shouldn't hear who will rock the map in this case. If there are dwellings of those ones, you may collect dozens and dozens of them via Portal. Mana Vortex is a pure imba, as you'll never run out of spell points; on small maps, Academy will be a factory of producing heroes one level above all others - 2 level vs. 1 is better difference than 26 vs. 25. A great disadvantage is that Dungeon is very expensive and even to get intermediate units you should use all types of resources. Generally - the best recipe to win is to play properly, not to choose a correct town. I wonder if you watch sports, but there will be always someone like Russia and Canada in hockey, Manchester City in nowadays English Premier League, or Mercedes in nowadays Formula One. Same for gaming, and to win Heroes 3 with Rampart or Fortress is still way easier than to win EPL with Sheffield United :)))
PS. As for Implosion on Gold Dragons. Of course I understand that, prior to all, you should control the battle. Mass Slow is a thing, as Elves, Pegasi, and Unicorns have decent speed. As for Berserk, it's possibly works on its best against Rampart - cast it on Dendroids, and that's all :)) However, Gold Dragons are powerful, thus taking them out in large amounts will still help.
In my opinion, Rampart is generally the worst town. Those who are tanky are horribly slow, and those who are fast are horribly fragile. Unicorns are fully in the middle, just a symbol of a "balanced" unit - 5th place, stronger than Manticores, Cyclops, Wyverns, and Psychic Elementals, and weaker than Champions, Nagas, Efreeti, and Dread Knights. Gold Dragons are unfairly expensive, matching best units by price but not by quality. Inferno has a great ability of demon farming, and Fortress is brilliant in defense, also providing the fastest unit in the game aside from 7 levels. Rampart attracts many people due to its units reminding Lord of the Rings, and also there are numerous campaigns about Rampart, yet I think that almost every town may outscore it: Castle and Stronghold by brute force, Tower, Dungeon and Conflux by magic, Inferno by its features like Town Gate and demon farming, and we are not mentioning Necropolis. Fortress has reliable Basilisks, imbalance Mighty Gorgons, Wyverns who are cool when sieging towns, and thanks to Dragonflies, it will cast first spell before 7 level units appear.--Dread Knight (talk) 11:10, 23 April 2021 (UTC)
Tower is not broken - its advantages come at a price of sky-high resource cost, you could build up 2 "cheap" towns for what you need to deck one Tower out. Its units generally need upgrades to be useful, or just to not suck (Gremlins, Nagas, Giants). Naga Queens & Titans are very strong, but also very expensive, and thanks to them the cost of week's full growth is over 28k which means you need external gold source or decisions every week what not to recruit... and this assumes you have managed to get to that point, good luck doing this against competent enemy. Lots of building requirements, so more time & resources needed. Heroes are meh apart from few top contenders like Solmyr, Neela, maybe Torosar. It's THE worst town to play in low resources environment.
Dungeon is A tier btw, because it's generally good at everything, its good stuff is expensive but not quite at Tower level, and the useless unit is Manticore/Scorpicore - apart from speed and health it could be 5th level unit, Minotaurs hit almost as hard and are cheaper & more numerous.
Rampart is kinda B - okay mix of offense/defense but only 1 very fragile shooter, units in general screw with magic, but 2 units are critically slow, best unit cannot be buffed & resurrected without Orb of Vulnerability, Gold Dragons have very high att/def but require tons of crystal, Treasury allows for gold shenanigans but this requires time, and heroes are average.
Fortress is A-C depending on situation. Cheap, tough troops are good in early game, but level 3 mage guild combined with overall slow troops is just plain bad in endgame. 2 flyers, both very fragile. Only 1 shooter, tough but not very strong. Mighty Gorgons are tough & scary but also slow & not that strong apart from their special ability. Hydras shine if you can get them in good position, otherwise they are slow and weak damage sponges as their stats apart from HP are very low. Crazy good heroes (Tazar) and bad (most of others).
Inferno is just plain bad, just compare it to Castle and notice the glaring power gap while the costs are similar. The only thing it does well is melee, the troops are overall good in offense but squishy, can execute Efreetgeddon or annoy slow/ranged armies with Devils. Magogs are the only ranged unit that can hurt your own troops. Devils are noticeably weaker than Angels but are similarly expensive. Efreeti are fast but fragile and don't do much damage on their own. Demon farming lets you convert bad troops to a bit more useful form, but it takes some time and isn't even close to Necromancy in efficiency. Town Gate is only useful if there are other Inferno towns. Heroes apart from Marius are meh to bad. The cost nerfs were made because all these things were noticed, and still it was not enough, without some power boost Inferno is about the only D/E tier town. - Fafner (talk) 13:04, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
Do you mean it all for big maps? If yes, I can just trust you. I play chiefly campaigns which don't have XL maps (poor Mutare, she is waiting for months). For smaller maps, Inferno has cool features, and Efreeti are in top 4 among 6th levels. Myself I feel there should be one single feature which can make Inferno really stronger: if Arch Devils were faster than Archangels. Inferno 7 level is weaker than Castle's one, but still a bit cheaper, and if it had that opportunity to be like, sorry, Sprite of its level, it would become an imba (Inferno already has Cerberi which are great 3 level units as opposed to many ones - Golems, Wights, Orcs, and I don't like Griffins). As for Tower, I wrote it's one of the worst towns for Impossible level (however, master gremlins help a lot).--Dread Knight (talk) 23:24, 26 April 2021 (UTC)