Talk:Sea Serpent and Haspid

Haspids are broken as hell in large numbers because when they take casualties, they get buffed. The formula looks complicated but it's not, just takes some time to crunch. I've did 2 cases as frankly it's depressing to see how much stronger Haspids become when they lose numbers.

2 starting Haspids: when 1 Haspid dies (half of the starting number) the remaining Haspid gets sqrt ((2x 300 + 300 / 1x 300 + 300) - 1) x 100% = sqrt ((900 / 600) - 1) x 100% = sqrt 0,5 x 100% = 0,7 x 100% = +70% Attack. So 49 because the game rounds 49,503 down. This is 19 more than Archangels have Defense. Gives Haspids 95% damage bonus against the defensively strongest town troop. Compare to other crazy strong unit, Ancient Behemoth. 49 Attack vs 19 Defense is 30 points of Attack more than Behemoths' Defense so 30x5=150% damage bonus. 75-137,5, average damage 106,25. Behemoths deal 52-87 to Haspids, average 69,5 as their Defense is 20/5 = 4. Something's not quite right, eh?

1000 starting Haspids: 500 Haspids die. According to formula they get sqrt ((1001 x 300 / 501 x 300) - 1) x 100%, so let's say sqrt(2-1) x 100%, so 1x 100%... +100% Attack. So 58 Attack. Let this sink in: 58 Attack. 28 more than Archangels' Defense so 140% damage bonus. Or 39 Attack over Defense so +195% damage bonus vs Ancient Behemoths. This is pretty much TRIPLE their normal damage that wouldn't be low anyway as Behemoths are squishy. 90-165, average 127,5. Remember that Behemoths' damage to Haspids is 52-87, avg 69,5. The horror... The horror!

Looks like Haspids are the new alpha predator in Heroes 3 ecosystem. --Fafner (talk) 17:41, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Cool, but the formula increases the Damage parameter, not the Attack. And there is "+" in the denominator, not "*", so yes, Haspids are pretty broken in theory. But in practice you usually don't want to loose such powerful creatures, and that means that you will not receive that great damage bonus.

When compared with Ancient Behemoths, do not forget that Behemoths have superior scaling against enemy heroes, especially in late game, thanks to their ability, which lets them steadily deal heavy damage.

Yet in 1v1 battle, ceteris paribus, they are trully the strongest lvl 7 creature in the game. -- Mortarial (talk) 21:23, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

That's right ^. --FirePaladin2 (talk) 21:26, 9 December 2020 (UTC)